Waking up an old beast.

[nodwyck]

This old monster is that nasty Improved Uncanny Dodge that rogues and barbies have.

Do you folks go straight by the book (rogue, and ONLY rogue can flank someone with this ability), or something else?

Which levels are counted as "rogue" levels for flanking?

1. counting sneak attack dice as 2 rogue levels (or 2 levels for rogue, 1 for other sneak dice)
2. Class levels of rogue, assassin, arcane trickster, Blackguard etc. classes with sneak dice together (bad idea. check Blk sneak dice frequency)
3. Class levels of classes with uncanny dodge added together
4. something else, different? weird?

Why am I asking this?
Everybody seems to have a house rule for this. We have used only rogue levels for this, but it seems unfair for assassins (who have Really Good sneak abilities, but not necessarily any rogue levels) and even more unfair, because monsters like Abyssal Ghoul has 5 sneak dice and the Book says they can be flanked only by rogues of 14th level or higher.

[AtlanteanAscendant]

considering ghouls are undead so sneak attacking them is pretty pointles anyways...

um, to be honest ive never seen any problems or had any issues with Improved Uncanny Dodge. considering the only real advantage it grants renders a character... um, resistant to sneak attack and flanking, i dont see it as being something that needs to be countered.

i.e. dont be sneaky around a sneak...

[nodwyck]

that +2 flanking bonus can be critical sometimes. that's why I'm asking.

[Hussar]

Have actually never had this come up in a game. Umm, I would go strictly by the book. The ghoul could not flank. Any PrC which adds onto rogue abilities would count, same as some PrC's add onto wizards for determining caster level. I would say that Assassin would likely count.

[nodwyck]

there's some things that my players have brought up.

1) the (high lvl) flanking could be like a rogue special ability - monks, barbies, pallys and bards have those strictly class level based specials, this might B the one for rogues.

2)Giving flanking to others might give a multi-multi-multiclassed characters an undeserved edge over single classed rogs

3) they have given up any chance of flanking damn nearly enyone (I do like rogues)

4) 3.5E pretty much took care of the abovementioned, ecept against barbies. they don't deserve better bonuses than rogues against flankers. there's no logic in barbies being better at avoiding flanking than rogs

the last one makes me think about addind a 3rd level of uncanny dodge for rogues only, and/or dropping the requirement by 2 lvls for single class rogues (others need to have the full 4 levels). Also thought of making the 'flank rule' only level dependant, not limited to any sneaky class - a fighter (the melee expert type) pretty much has the right of a benefit for clever maneuvering.