Chivalry - Does it Exist, and is it Appreciated?

[LadyWinterWolf]

This topic isn't a world event, but I remember this discussion taking place on Planet, and it was interesting until it got spammed into oblivion. So I took a few quotes from the thread, and am reviving it here.
Why you ask? Well, BRO was questioning himself as a gentleman, and I've always felt, since the first day I met him (online of course) that not only was he a true gentleman, but a gentle man. I appreciate those men who practice the chivalrous arts, and to them I say thank you and.....





Grammar Wizard

Has anyone heard of, like, chivalry and knights and so forth? I always act like this, and you know what it gets me? MOCKERY! I am polite, and corteous, and all I get for my troubles is insulted! And, to top it off, I can't do squat about it because of my stupid lousy f**ing ethics! How did those knights get any friends? And another thing: does anyone else do this? I want to know if I'm not alone...

LWW

From a personal viewpoint, I really don't see much in a man who drinks, smokes, or takes drugs, especially in excess. A man who abuses a woman in any manner, whether physical, emotional or mental, should be boiled in oil....slowly, while alive.

A man who opens a door for a lady, helps her with her seat or coat, brings little gifts like wildflowers or a stuffed bear, and continues this practice way into the relationship whether it leads to marriage or not, is one to be cherished.

I could go on with more, but I don't want to be too boring on the subject.

Grammar Wizard

Ah, LWW, now I understand why your title is LADY Wiccan Wolf.... if only there were more women like you....

LWW

Thank you m'lord GW...........(a few pages later)Standards...I've already seen how so many on this one thread have the same standards, but are diappointed by so much rudeness, or not being appreciated. But one should not give up such a high standard because of the discouragement, or peer pressure that it is "not cool", because there are people out there who need you, need the chivalry. And if everyone gives up so easily, then what happens to the ones in need, the ones who would appreciate the chivalry, and honor

[Draxy]

Chivalry as it was described in "La Morte D'Arhtur" very probably never existed anymore than a historicly verifiable Arthur did. But, that said, the type of chivalry that LWW describes is still alive and kicking... again unfortunately, it is often being kicked back nowadays. Why?

I think it's because of the ultra aggressive feminist reaction to any act that can be seen as old fashioned as "old fashioned" is something they seem to equate with oppressive. I've had women all but bite my head off for opening a door for them, or for holding their chair for them. God knows that I am not trying to oppress them or to make them feel weak, but they often reacted that way none the less.

I understand where it comes from, of course, but it does NOT excuse it. Individual women, as is only right and natural, can be as ignorant and pig headed as any individual man.

Draxy

[Black Robed One]

Well, as some of you may know, a few wonderful people at this site as well as at old PlanetAD&D (LWW and Regina for example) consider me a gentleman. While I prefer not to make such opinions about myself with certainness (some of you could notice at description I gave to myself, that I wrote: '...almost to the point of being a gentleman', rather then 'as a gentleman', when I mentioned my usually polite manner of speech), I have no choice but to trust others in this matter, which is now refelcted in my title.

I cannot say, whether I am ture gentleman (as some people say) or not, as I cannot be polite and gentle all the time, I tend to be rather rude, when somebody manage to make me angry, and some ex-members of evil PlanetAD&D could certainly see me cursing, flirting, participating in various arguiments and flame wars, as well as bashing and flaming others. And... [/Secretive whisper] ...Truth to tell, I tend to spam from time to time as well! Awful, isn't it? [/Secretive whisper]

However, despite all my inperfections, I truly believe in Chivalry, and believe, that Chivalry is still alive. IMHO, Chivalry will live as long as there is at last one man who belives in Chivalry!

Truth, Chivalry isn't really appreciated now, especially among the teenagers (which is unfortunate, as teenagers will once inherit this world, and it will up to them to determine, what it will look like), but there are still people, like Grammar Wizard, LWW and me, who still believe in Chivalry. I hope, the these people will be able to bring Chivalry to the next generation, and those of the next generation will be able to bring it to next generation, and so on and on, until Chivalry will be appreciated once again. Thus, Chivarly will survive through the ages.

[Hussar]

Y'know what I thought was really funny? I spent the last several years working in Korea. Now, here is a country which has perfected Confucionism to a high art. Which basically means that women get the very short end of the stick. Now, I don't particularly think of myself as chivalrous or anything like that, if I think about it at all, but, holy cow, holding a door open or stepping out of the way for a girl made me a bloody superstar ! I couldn't believe it. The women around me (and, working in a children's school at the time, there were quite a number) were simply stunned by the slightest show of politeness. It was incredible. Having lived overseas for quite a while now, I realize something. While we may think of ourselves as rude and inconsiderate, we have NOTHING on some cultures. Be thankful for what civility we have. It can be a LOT worse.

[Merkuri]

It's nice when a guy opens a door for me. I appreciate it. My ex used to do that for me all the time. That's part of what attracted me to him. Unfortunately, I later found out that his old-fashioned chivalry also came with an old-fashioned view of what women should and shouldn't do. He disapproved of my interest in karate, the fact that I only wear dresses on special occasions, even my short hair. He broke down crying in front of me one day when he realized that when I was hanging around him and his friends he thought of me as "one of the guys" (a fact I was proud of until I realized it was what he was crying over). Now, I'm not trying to insinuate that guys who open doors for women always have an oppressive attitude, just that this has been my experience. I like when a guy cares enough to open a door or otherwise be considerate, but when you think about it the underlying suggestion (whether intended or not) is that women need men to open the door for them. This suggestion is what makes a lot of women opposed to door-opening and other "chivalrous" activities. When somebody tells them that's chivalry is dead they say "Thank God." I have my own personal compromise, however. If I want doors opened for me, yet I insist on equality, the only logical solution is for me to open doors for other people. And I do. For guys and girls. This was another thing that my ex dissaproved of. Even though he didn't complain, I could see he was uncomfortable every time I opened a door for him. I say, what's wrong with that? We don't have to kill chivalry to ensure equality. We just have to apply it to both sides of the equation.

;D

[VladTaltos]

grrr look what you did now BRO now im gona have to open doors and put my jacket over pudels and stuff no im just kiding i try to do that stuff but not many girls like that down here they hit me a lot and damn it starts to hurt

[Wyrmfire]

Well, I guess it all depends on why a guy is being chivalrous. If he's doing it because he think, on some level, that a woman cannot handle fending for herself, and because "it's what his parents did" (one of the worst phrases in the world), then he needs to be slapped with a wet codfish.

But, I don't think that chivalry necessarily has to be applied equally, either. Maybe I am a bit old fashioned in this respect, but I really think that a woman has put a guy in her debt just by going on the date in the first place. For me, being chivalrous is just a way to say "thank you" for being willing to get to know me.

[VladTaltos]

you have a good point there

[Merkuri]

Wyrmfire said:

Maybe I am a bit old fashioned in this respect, but I really think that a woman has put a guy in her debt just by going on the date in the first place.

Ya know, a lot of women are more desparate to get dates than you guys seem to think.

And I wasn't just talking about dates. I dunno about anyone else, but a guy who only opens doors to women he's on dates with doens't strike me as particularly chivalrous. He just wants to impress his date. True chivalry, in the old-fashioned sense of the word, implies respect for all women, not just those you want to jump in the sack with.

[VladTaltos]

I try to hold doors open all the time the just think im gona hit on them so

[CharleHu$$tle]

Chivalry is for fools. Men who have no game and are to ugly to catch a girl.

Sure women all say that they want a gentleman. Please!!!

nice guys get used like tampons by women.

Get some balls and Learn how to keep your pimp hand way strong. Now that is true Chivalry

[VladTaltos]

what can i say man i have no pimp hand

[Merkuri]

What are you doing in this thread, Chuck? You wouldn't know chivalry if he stuck his sword up your

[RowanMoonWynd]

I love it when men show that little extra attention like opening doors and pulling your chair out for you. It's the little things that make a girl feel extra special and I hope to see it never die!! Long live Bro and the other men in this world who are like him!!!!!

[Wyrmfire]

Merkuri said:

Ya know, a lot of women are more desparate to get dates than you guys seem to think.

Doesn't matter. Every woman is perfect, haven't you heard that? ;D